Manual and Auto Sailing

[Blue710]

Hi folks, hope all Is well...

I jumped back Into VSNG recently and basically focusing on sailing boats. Bought a couple from SIM3D, and used some of the ones found In the library (Bavaria 40 etc.).

While trying to have fun sailing, I found myself with quite a frustration. Readings on wind direction on different Instruments at times were different, at times sailing with the wind was difficult or just not posible, changing from auto to manual sailing had It´s on challenge as main sails would not shift totally from one side to the other, and bumping up wind (kts) did not make the boat (s) move any better, and or gain speed sailing with the wind at times.

Trying to turn the boat (rudder Input) did not have any effect at times making me use the motor to turn (steer). In a nut shell, stressed out when I was supposed to relax sailing!

I figured out that disactivating the wind buffet, and lowering the size of waves helped a bit, but still It was not manageable to a point were I was understanding what was going on, or what I was doing wrong. Their were times were auto managing the sails was going nuts as If the wind was all over the place. Wind direction was quite variable most of the times, so really I don´t know what was going on. It was difficult to have a controlled environment If any.

So the question Is, what am I doing wrong, If so, and Is It that difficult to sail In VSNG, or Is It not stable and/or bugged? Any help or opinions are more then welcome, thank you.

Blue710

[Blue710]

Ok, I seem to be getting better at the sailing part of the sim, but although I have a rough Idea of what the "sailing" panel gauges Indicate, I just wanto to confirm as It really doesn't state It on the manual...

- Precisely the wind gauge, IIRC there are two arrows (green and orange) on the panel wind gauge. I presume one Is wind direction and the other sail or boat direction? Is their a apparent wind direction In the wind gauge?

- Sailing window (S key), same deal but In this case I think there Is a apparent wind arrow (smaller). The wind compas Is a bit odd, or I don´t understand It, should It be the opposite end of the propeller the wind direction, or the propeller end? We also have two bands on top of the gauges left and right, one Is red, the other Is green. I would Imagen that the green band Is "positive" wind (sailing with the wind), and the red band "negative" wind (against the wind)?

- Then we have the Jib and Main Sail gauges were we have two additional arrows (smaller) green and blue on both sides of the top end of the gauge which I can only guess Is wind and sail direction?

- Lastly, do the smaller blue buttons (bottom end) on the gauges do anything, or are they just for show?



Boat Is heading 30º, and wind direction Is from 131º...







All fun and Interesting stuff, loving It

Thanks and safe sailing!

[Sailorjohn]

Hmmm...where to start.
Have you sailed in the RW? Or is NG your first exposure to sailing? You can learn the basics of sailing in an hour; becoming a proficient sailor takes years, if not a lifetime. You learn something new every time you go out.

First thing, the wind you see on the boat is the apparent wind. If the boat is stationary, moored, then the apparent wind and true wind are the same. But once the boat is moving, the apparent wind is the vector sum of true wind and boat speed/direction. In general, you can't sail closer upwind than say, 40 degrees off apparent wind...closer to the wind the sails will be luffing (shaking and flapping) and lose their drive. I see you're sailing Anna, which is a fairly traditional racing/cruising sloop, quite close-winded. Older designs such as gaff rigs, won't point as high...say around 50 degrees off apparent wind. Square riggers can't point above 60-70 degrees (I have 4 years in Eagle, 295' barque, 23 sails). If manually sailing in NG, 45 deg is probably a good target for pointing upwind. The apparent wind indicators in NG have those red (port) and green (starboard) zones simply to show when you're on port or starboard tack. The individual sail gauges are for the sailb (Big, or mainsail), and sails (small or jib sail), and show the angle of the sail off the wind (green arrow), and the efficiency of the sail at that angle (orange arrow). The most efficient sail angle is between close reach and beam reach, around 70 deg or so offwind. Further offwind, broad reaching or running, the apparent wind drops below true wind as the boat is moving with the wind...so boat speed vector is subtracted from true. That's when it's nice to have a spinnaker!

When you start a sailing situation in NG, it is a little difficult because wind speed by default is only a few knots, from 000...dead ahead. The sails are luffing with boom flopping from side to side. You're in "Irons" with no headway...and will eventually wind up going backwards. You may have to 'cheat' and either turn the boat offwind, or push the wind direction away from 000. Or put your helm hard over either way and wait for the wind to push you backwards and gain sternway to swing the bow offwind. You can also simplify things by unchecking wind gusts, so wind will be steady. This all has less to do with sailing and more to do with NG format. BTW, the wind vane (which I seldom use) shows apparent wind...the propellor end faces the direction the wind is coming from.

You're on the right track. I suggest you put a few sailboats on waypoints in a triangular pattern racecourse, and try to manually sail the same course and beat 'em. It's not that hard to do, because autosail generally doesn't point as high, nor does it use tactics to time when to tack, when to 'pinch' closer to the wind, etc.

Fair winds

[Blue710]

Hmmm...where to start.
Have you sailed in the RW? Or is NG your first exposure to sailing? You can learn the basics of sailing in an hour; becoming a proficient sailor takes years, if not a lifetime. You learn something new every time you go out.

First thing, the wind you see on the boat is the apparent wind. If the boat is stationary, moored, then the apparent wind and true wind are the same. But once the boat is moving, the apparent wind is the vector sum of true wind and boat speed/direction. In general, you can't sail closer upwind than say, 40 degrees off apparent wind...closer to the wind the sails will be luffing (shaking and flapping) and lose their drive. I see you're sailing Anna, which is a fairly traditional racing/cruising sloop, quite close-winded. Older designs such as gaff rigs, won't point as high...say around 50 degrees off apparent wind. Square riggers can't point above 60-70 degrees (I have 4 years in Eagle, 295' barque, 23 sails). If manually sailing in NG, 45 deg is probably a good target for pointing upwind. The apparent wind indicators in NG have those red (port) and green (starboard) zones simply to show when you're on port or starboard tack. The individual sail gauges are for the sailb (Big, or mainsail), and sails (small or jib sail), and show the angle of the sail off the wind (green arrow), and the efficiency of the sail at that angle (orange arrow). The most efficient sail angle is between close reach and beam reach, around 70 deg or so offwind. Further offwind, broad reaching or running, the apparent wind drops below true wind as the boat is moving with the wind...so boat speed vector is subtracted from true. That's when it's nice to have a spinnaker!

When you start a sailing situation in NG, it is a little difficult because wind speed by default is only a few knots, from 000...dead ahead. The sails are luffing with boom flopping from side to side. You're in "Irons" with no headway...and will eventually wind up going backwards. You may have to 'cheat' and either turn the boat offwind, or push the wind direction away from 000. Or put your helm hard over either way and wait for the wind to push you backwards and gain sternway to swing the bow offwind. You can also simplify things by unchecking wind gusts, so wind will be steady. This all has less to do with sailing and more to do with NG format. BTW, the wind vane (which I seldom use) shows apparent wind...the propellor end faces the direction the wind is coming from.

You're on the right track. I suggest you put a few sailboats on waypoints in a triangular pattern racecourse, and try to manually sail the same course and beat 'em. It's not that hard to do, because autosail generally doesn't point as high, nor does it use tactics to time when to tack, when to 'pinch' closer to the wind, etc.

Fair winds

Hi and thank you SJ!

Glad someone around here takes some time to answer

Yes, I just got Into the sailing aspect of NG, and In sailing In general so you´re reply, help and guidance have been of much help! I just bought eSail Simulator, just for the learning experience and doing so these past days. I did sail a bit when I was a teen on a friends Hobie Cat circa 45 years ago, but can´t say aside from the fun we had that I remember much. This was In Florida and the sea Is much a lifestyle there. I also play a wargame called Close Action which Is a tactical ship to ship 17th century naval combat game and It simulates quite a lot of things like going In Irons, reaching, tacking etc. Overall I am just fascinated with the Age of Sail era, so even If It´s just In a sim, I want to learn all I can. Besides, I am over 60 now and If I was In a real boat right now, my head would be hanging of the side of the boat!

Again, Thank you Sailorjohn, I hope to be a good sailor someday even If It´s just virtually! I could not afford the Anna In real life anyway!

Cheers, and fair winds Sir. <S>

[Sailorjohn]

My pleasure, Blue

I'm over 80, but sailing is still in my blood. We still have a motorsailer, and I've had over 50 boats...up to 54'. Learned to sail as a pre-teen in an ancient, leaky sailing canoe...bail and sail. Did intercollegiate sailing in International 12 1/2s, and 24' Ravens, where our crew took first place in New England. My 'day job' was commanding Coast Guard cutters. But most of my sailing now is virtual. The late Sharpy even cloned our previous motorsailer...Windsor Knot.

[Blue710]

My pleasure, Blue

I'm over 80, but sailing is still in my blood. We still have a motorsailer, and I've had over 50 boats...up to 54'. Learned to sail as a pre-teen in an ancient, leaky sailing canoe...bail and sail. Did intercollegiate sailing in International 12 1/2s, and 24' Ravens, where our crew took first place in New England. My 'day job' was commanding Coast Guard cutters. But most of my sailing now is virtual. The late Sharpy even cloned our previous motorsailer...Windsor Knot.

Hi SJ,

That´s quite a career and a Interesting life you have had If I may say so, and a passionate one too! Thank you for sharing that, and I will pick up that clone from SIM3D eagerly! It looks great and Sharpy seems to have done a great job. It will be a pleasure to sail, thank you!

So yesterday I decided to do a showcase video In regards to sailing In VSNG, which I hope exposes sailing, VS NG, SIM3D as well as the late Sharpy (sorry to her/read that) In a attempt to promote all three on YT. Hopefully and slowly I can give VS NG and all Involved my small contribution to keeping VS NG alive via some videos and comments (I have a thread open on Age of Sail over at SimHQ forum).
My small YT channel and video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YK4oQLW84Y4

and here´s nice historical video that I enjoyed recently on the last of a romantic era:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCShq8cpai0

I´ll keep learning and "diving" In this beautiful part of humanity and history.

Again, thank you SJ for sharing a slice of you´re past and present. Good care Sir. and all my respects and gratefulness to you´re duty at sea <S>

Blue